Lips Xbox 360 Review
Karaoke is no longer exclusive to drunken workers at an office Christmas party or Japanese salarymen letting off steam, anyone is now able to test the patience and batter the eardrums of their friends and family in the comfort of their own homes.
Sony’s Singstar franchise isn’t close to being the first karaoke video games, but they are by far the most popular, especially in Europe, selling over 12 million copies. Having already been ‘inspired’ by Sony’s other casual gaming successes with EyeToy knock-off Xbox Live Vision and Scene It?’s homage to Buzz!, Microsoft have decided that they need some microphone peripherals for 360 gamers to put beside their camera and big-button controllers.
The microphones themselves are excellent pieces of hardware, in smooth black and white colours with stylish glowing LED’s at the base, and as is expected on a current generation console they are, of course, wireless.
The mics are also motion-sensitive, which adds a few nifty features. For example, at any time during a solo performance, a second player can simply shake their mic to instantly join in the singsong. Also, after bouts of good singing players will be given an onscreen pose to perform that activates a Guitar Hero-style ‘Star Stream’ to earn bonus points. Finally, when not singing, players can also tap or shake the mic to the beat to play an appropriate percussion instrument.
These movement-based features add an extra element to performing on top of the usual singing, and are a welcome addition to the genre, especially as so much else of Lips fails to even meet the standards set by the original PS2 Singstar over four-and-a-half years ago.
This game does not support the 360 camera, has no adjustable difficulty modes, no record of your highest scores on each song, no unlockables, no career mode, and no option to playback a recording of your vocals (although on second thoughts that might be for the best).
Lips is essentially the ‘Wii Music’ of the karaoke-gaming scene, with no way to fail a song and an extremely forgiving scoring system. Don’t worry if your voice wavers when you can’t hit the right note, because Lips will simply give you a Vibrato bonus! There are ten star-related ranks ranging from Rock to Big Bang, but even attempting songs that I don’t know the tune of and actively despise (I’m looking at you Chris Brown) I never saw anything below the fourth-highest rank of Super Nova.
Lips has clearly been designed as an accessible game that would be perfect to spark off some fun times during a party. The front-end menu is extremely stylish and simple-to-use, and the visual background of the game can be adjusted to many equally-snazzy styles and colours.
The Jukebox mode allows you to play a succession of music videos, either from a specific playlist that you’ve created, or simply a random selection. This is ideal to leave running on your TV during a party, and any would-be hit artists can simply pick up a mic, give it a shake and instantly start singing whatever song is currently playing.
Medals can be gained in six different categories, Pitch is rewarded for hitting the right notes, Stability given for holding those notes for the right length, Rhythm for well.. having rhythm, Technique for using vocal expertise like vibrato and Performance for successful gesturing to trigger Star Stream. People who aren’t currently singing can press buttons on the Xbox 360 controller to play various percussive noises and gain the Party medal.
It’s nice to give non-participants something to do, but it can be a bit off-putting if the guy with the controller isn’t tapping to the beat. The rewarding of medals can often feel somewhat arbitrary; as does the fact that the maximum score on each song doesn’t appear to be the same.
There are several party modes (unfortunately not including Pass-the-Mic), Vocal Fighters is a simple Vs. game which sees you scoring hits against your opponent with superior singing, Kiss is a co-operative mode in which successful duo singing brings a couple closer together and hopefully kissing, which is activated by a simultaneous tilting of microphones, and Bomb challenges you with dousing a constantly re-igniting fuse by singing to fill a glass with water and then tilting the mic to pour.
Whilst attempts to provide alternatives to straight singing are appreciated, these particular multiplayer modes end up being more distracting than entertaining. Sadly, the only online multiplayer feature that Lips has is the option to send a challenge to a friend to beat your score on a particular song. Once each player has had two attempts to get the best score the challenge is over and these high scores are not saved…
Of course, one of the major aspects of any musical game will be its songlist, and with 41 tracks Lips certainly beats any Singstar game in volume. Obviously, whether the tracklist is better is a matter of personal preference, but it undoubtedly has a decent mix of classics. Golden Oldies such as “Stand By Me”, “Another One Bites the Dust”, “Take On Me”, “It’s Raining Men” and “ABC” are excellent karaoke fodder, and newer songs like “Bleeding Love”, “Umbrella”, “Young Folks”, “Suddenly I See”, “White Flag” and “Yellow” work surprisingly well to warble along to.
Of course, being a current-gen music game, Lips also features the option of downloadable tracks complete with music videos at 160MS points (£1.36) a pop, although less than 10 tracks are available at time of writing, with more becoming available each week hopefully the Lips DLC will swell to rival the Singstar Store.
But wait! Why would you need to download tracks when Lips has the much talked-about feature of allowing you to import any songs from your own personal music collection? Surely you can just take any DRM-free tracks from your 360 HDD, mp3 player or network connected PC and wail away to your heart’s content?
Well, technically this is true (although iPod Touch and iPhone owners beware that your newfangled technology is not supported) but imported tracks do not include lyrics or any pitch rating at all. Strangely, the game still scores you on these tracks, but you could quite easily fart into the mic, and provided you could keep it up for the duration of the tune you’d end up with an impressive score. This means that importing any tracks is essentially pointless as there really isn’t any more interactivity than singing along to the radio.
Ultimately, the enjoyment that you’ll receive from Lips depends entirely on the people that you’re playing it with. Lips makes an excellent party title for non-gamers especially, and the whole package oozes contemporary coolness meaning that you’ll never be embarrassed to bring it out in front of friends. However, Lips disappoints by lacking in features in almost every area, and although the microphones set a new standard for future singing games to strive towards, the functionality is often worse than games nearly half-a-decade old.
94 comments ↓
singmonkey
December 3rd, 2008
in defense of lips, i think the game deserves a much better score than this. it’s a party game and claims to be nothing else thus the lack of a career mode should be utterly irrelevant in this review. if you have played lips enough you know that the game is about the title you earn after each song not the score itself which varies tremendously between songs. Infinity is the highest title you can achieve (I think) and it is incredibly difficult to get Infinity; i somehow wonder if the reviewer even knew that before declaring the scoring mechanic too easy. He makes it sound like 3 Levels of Difficulty is the music games holy grail. It isn’t, its a developer copout because they weren’t technically capable enough at the time to make a single mode that can challenge serious singers while making novices feel good. Lips succeeds well in my opinon in this regard. It accomodates all players at a party and works brilliantly. For this innovation alone, I’d give them 8/10. though i find scoring somewhat more flat in freestyle than on disc songs, you cannot as this reviewer claims just fart yourself to a superior score. That’s bollucks. It’s as inaccurate as when Eurogamer first claimed the exact same thing – did this guy do his homework or just crib notes from eurogamer?
Seth
December 3rd, 2008
I was aware of the Infinity rank, but putting in one extremely difficult rank does not excuse the developers the scant lack of features elsewhere.
Its a good game if all you want to do is sing along to songs, but you don’t need a games console to do that.
I can guarantee you that I have achieved Supernova rank on a Freestyle song by simply blowing into the mic for the duration of the track.
I haven’t read Eurogamer’s review, but if another critic has said the same things as myself, perhaps that’s because they’re true?
singmonkey
December 4th, 2008
I appreciate your reply Seth. I guess my take on it is that Supernova is not that good a score and I’ve done well just humming along to singstar as well so I don’t think Lips is alone in that department. Rereading your review I’m curious what features you think the game is missing that it deserves that score. I’ve played Jumper: Griffin’s Story and I feel I have an idea of what deserves a 5/10 or much less. with lips its like you have a product that more than matches the important features of singstar, introduces depth with gesture, vibrato scoring, etc that we all missed in sinstar, beats ss with solid wireless microphones, provides a good starter set of music, has an ambitious but currently somewhat flawed but fun freestyle mode, has really innovative fun mini-games and all at a pretty good price. head to head, i’ve seen lips beat singstar at a party for fun until you max out the current song library (but i don’t see why this is not fixable over time). if inis promised me a single player experience, I’d be pretty pissed but thats not how it was sold. If they promised me robust online features i’d be miffed but frankly i don’t use that feature on ss ps3 right now anyway. what i want most is better scoring on your own music especially medals. next i miss onlien leaderboards especially for songs from your ipod. the lips.com site promised that so my guess is it will happen sometime. but all in all i love me some lips – now if i can ge t some christmas dlc i’m set for the holidays
Seth
December 4th, 2008
I’m glad that you’re having fun with the game, singmonkey. Just because I gave it an average score, doesn’t mean I don’t think you can have fun with it. I just have to try and be critical about these things.
In fact, my wife loves this game and can hardly put the mic down!
I just felt disappointed that Lips failed to meet its potential. As I mentioned in the review, things like camera support, high score tables, great online support and vocal playback seem like obvious inclusions that have been passed over for some reason.
I do think the mics are brilliant, and that gesturing is a good addition, but I do stand my assessment that the scoring system feels wayyy to arbitrary. When I sing a song that I don’t know, very badly, missing all the notes and timing and yet I still get end up with five medals… something is wrong there.
But despite my criticisms, this is definately a game that you can have multiplayer fun with, and is great for non-gamers. I just feel that iNiS could have offered so much more for a single-player or more in-depth experience.
stevey
December 5th, 2008
come on seth, theres only a 5% chance anyone would ever agree with you…
get off your high horse
James
December 5th, 2008
Looking at meacritic he isn’t alone in thinking it’s crap but theres a few other sites that have rated it highly.
Still it’s mostly average reviews.
Gustino
December 6th, 2008
Jsut bought lips today, tried it single user, just for some songs, the only thing I reaaly miss is the abillity to record your songs. I don’t care if it sounds shite or not, it is still fun on partys to hear it once more if somebody does sthn funny or really brilliant, they shoudl make an update soon to fix that..
Mike
December 29th, 2008
I really can’t figure out how to get some of the medals. One of the achievements is getting 12 medals in one song. I can’t imagine how to do this.
Are you supposed to use the controller to press buttons during the song? I have tried this, but nothing has happened. I don’t see anything that seems meant to push along with on the screen.
Is there a certain time that I am supposed to shake the microphone in order to use it as an instrument for a medal? If so, how do I know when?
…I’m a little bit disappointed with the way the microphones recognize my voice. I downloaded the new Christmas song “Have a Holly Jolly Christmas” and I simply blew into the microphone for the entire song, and I got a ranking of Galaxy on it!…but when I tried singing with my real voice, I noticed that the first six words of that song are “Ding” and “Dong”…Yet the game would NEVER allow me to have credit for singing those all of those simple words correctly…With that in mind, it seems IMPOSSIBLE to get the achievement of getting “Cool” on “Every Page.”…Well, unless you blow into the microphone the whole time and get lucky.
I really do like Lips, though. I think it is awesome. I think it deserves a score of at least 7 out of 10.
Seth
December 29th, 2008
As far as I can tell, the only way to get 12 medals in one song is to have two players singing co-op, and one person doing percussion on the controller.
To get the party medal, someone must tap any button on the 360 pad along to the beat of the song. There is a difficult-to-see ‘galaxy’ symbol that appears at the top of the screen when you’re correctly tapping to the beat. It grows progessively larger as you stay on the beat. You need to get this symbol to it’s maximum size to get the medal. It’s very difficult because unlike the rest of the game, it’s not very forgiving, and the ‘beat’ often doesnt appear to relate to the actual tempo of the song.
I’ve never got close to getting a ‘Cool’ rating on every page, but my wife managed it on Coldplay’s ‘Yellow’. I suppose it’s just best to pick a song that you know best. Either that or just hum along to one of the rap songs.
Lips is certainly a game with a lot of fun potential, but that’s more down to the people who are playing it rather than the software itself.
Jenny
January 6th, 2009
I really like this game and I got it about a week ago. But then I tried to put my own songs on it. I connected my ipod(nano) to the USB port and the songs(357) appeared on the “Get Music” screen. I added one of the songs to the “Sing” menu, but when i went to “Sing” and chose that song, it didn’t work! The video played for 2 seconds and then went away and gave me a 0 for my score. The music didn’t even start playing!
Did the music have to come directly from Itunes? Because I know most of my songs come from CD’s. If that’s not the problem, is there anything else I’m doing wrong? Thank you!
Chris Weeks
January 20th, 2009
I am an avid videogamer of almost 20 years, and i have a doctorate in Computer Science and have myself developed a number of 2D and 3D games as a hobbyist programmer. So i see myself in a position to criticise this review immensely. Does the reviewer realise that the main aim of a video game, and in my opinion the only aim, is to provide the end user with a FUN experience. It is not about drab online features and leaderboards/scoreboards and it is not about cramming 2 billion polygons on screen at one time. I have owned every console since the SEGA master system and have seen a drastic move from games devleoped with playability and longevity in mind to graphic intensive exercises in 3D simulation and aesthetic design. Whilst pleasing on the eye these games hold no lifespan and in many cases are dull and boring. These games often have scoreboards etc… does this entitle them to a high score.??? I was sceptical of Lips, i bought this as a present for my young daughter and i have not let her play it, i have hogged it the entire time. The mechanism itself is much better than singstar and the ability to sing along to any song from usb device or cd is superb. I love the direction lips is taking the singing games tbh. The video upload thing is a non-issue for me because i bought this game so that my daughter could sing along to Rhianna and Duffy, not so she can upload a movie of herself, i have an expensive camcorder if i want to do this.
I would have to say this is a very poor review. Remember folks, games are for FUN, not for online SCOREBOARD GLOATING..
Peace Out
Chris
Chris Weeks
January 20th, 2009
The Cool on every page achievement was one of the first acheivements i got. You just have to aim to get the stability i believe that way you are singing with the right temp and regardless of the harmonics you are hitting the same note, albeit perhaps the wrong one, for the alloted time. “Yellow” is a good song to do this in as the tempo is slow.
I have not however achieved the infinity one. Is this a rank per song if so how do you get it, i have achieved 3.5 million as a score for some songs. Is this given for a perfect rendition or what?
Chris Weeks
January 20th, 2009
lol having re-read some of the comments above i would have to suggest to Seth to go on XFactor or pop idol if he is getting 5 medals for a song he doesnt know and cant sing because you must have one hell of a sweet voice.
I sing some songs i know and love and i have a decent enuf voice for singing, unlike the missus, and i struggle to get the technique and stability medals, you have to be near perfect for around a quarter of the song in one go to get the stability medal that is quite tough. I also dont understand the argument about the scoring system can you explain??? Surely if EVERYONE gets millions of points then why does this matter, a better singer will win by a few thousand points more than a bad singer, just like he/she would win by a few points if the scoring system was harsher.
Its all about “relativity” and im not talking Physics. Many games utilise the “weaker player catch up” feature with great success. After all who would want to play with you if you are a star singer in the choir? This way it makes things interesting and u get points for performance and not just voice talent. If you wanna test urself against the best go and try and outsing Beyonce or Mariah. LOL
Seth
January 20th, 2009
Thanks for your feedback, Chris.
I’m afraid that I don’t agree that the only aim of videogames is to provide us with fun. If you’re referring to karaoke games specifically then that opinion is closer to the truth.
I’m not quite sure why you were referring to graphics as these arent really relevant in karaoke games, and nevertheless Lips has excellent visual presentation.
Online leaderboards would have been, but this game doesnt even keep a record of your own personal high scores. This isnt something I care in most titles, but the point of karaoke games is that they should try to do something more than allow you to sing along to the words.
You say that you personally don’t care about the lack of features, but I wouldn’t be a very good reviewer if I just dismissed this would I? I have to compare this game to it’s competition, and although it excels in some aspects, I find it to be lacking in many more.
Of course, none of this means that you can’t have fun playing the game. If you read the review and my comments then you’ll see that I’ve said that there is a lot of fun potential for this game, and you can have a great time with it if all you want to do is sing along to songs, but none of this is down to the software. I expect a videogame to offer a lot more than simple karaoke.
Apologies if my criticisms of the scoring system were unclear, but I don’t believe I ever mentioned any issues with the actual numbers being awarded. The problem is that it’s often difficult to tell whether you’ve actually done a good performance or not, because you are constantly being rewarded.
The fact that I got five medals on a song that I don’t know or like certainly doesn’t mean that I’m a great singer (quite the contrary in fact), it just means that the scoring system on this game does not feel valid. Several of the hip-hop/rap songs seem almost impossible to do badly at.
Sure, a better singer will get a higher score than a worse singer more often than not, but you are mistaken if you think there is any ‘rubber-banding’ to help out weaker players.
At the end of the day, if you’re happy to just sing along to some songs then you’ll love this game. If you want something to rival the karaoke competition then you may be disappointed.
Grubsworth
January 20th, 2009
i bought this game so that my daughter could sing along to Rhianna and Duffy,
Your raising your child to be an idiot.
Just saying.
Now if you made video games that were purely about fun how come nobody plays them?
Me thinks Seth is reviewing this game as a professional review, wheras your reviewing it like a havent got a clue lads mag like Nuts dishing out 5/5 because its an action game.
Go play WiiMusic and tell me thats not missing fundermentally essensial gameplay hooks, because Nintendo keeps telling me its just good fun.
And hey everyone hates that.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
lol, Grubsworth i think you are the idiot… You lose all credibility when you say something like “I don’t agree that the only aim of videogames is to provide us with fun.” Seth i challenge you “NAME THE GAME GENRE WHOSE PRIMARY AND ONLY AIM IS NOT TO PROVIDE FUN”
What i am suggesting is that the downfalls of the Lips game do not constitute the amount of points it has dropped (50%).
And Grubsworth, my daughter is 5 years old and so Bach and Mozart are a little boring for her. Im a firm believer in children being children.
Grubsworth, your message didnt actually add anything to the debate so please desist in future from talking WIND.
lol.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
And i was only mentioning graphics to express my feelings that for the most part video games are starting to go down the pan. It used to be that the majority of games released were actually fun and enjoyable.
A stark contrast to the market today where we have a huge amount of graphically accomplished piles of drivel. Im saying that Lips deserves a much better score because of the direction it has taken the genre, and we must always encourage innovation. My contention is that with a score of 5 this discourages the potential buyer,dispite your review contents, and if there are not enough buyers spending their ‘money votes’ there is no Lips2.
I think if a reviewer does not take this kind of consideration then he/she is being too frivolous and perhaps a little naive. I am NOT criticising the reviewer for his art of review but just this review and the possible permutations of the score.
Rock on, i love debating games. Hey if everyone was perfect, like me, then the world would be a boring place.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
DEFINITION OF ‘GAME’
any form of play or way of playing; amusement; recreation; sport; frolic; play
any specific contest, engagement, amusement, computer simulation, or sport involving physical or mental competition under specific rules, as football, chess, or war games
So you can see where the FUN element comes from.
Ask yourself this. Why do we play games?
It will be difficult to answer this without using the idea of fun.
Challenge extended….
lol
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
lol one last thought for old grubsworth,
you do realise when you read a manufacturers’ description/synopsis of their product…that this might ….just be …a …little……biased.
If Nintendo say the game is FUN but its NOT then it deserves a bad review score. My argument here, which is plain if you can read and show an aptitude for rational thought, is that here we have a game which the masses have construed ‘great fun’, which the reviewer has also stated (SEVERAL TIMES, GRUBSWORTH) is fun… and it still gets a tough review score.
And ask yourself this also, if these reviewers guidelines and reviewer checklists of what a certain game in a certain genre should have is/are so infalable???? then why are games not given uniformly identical scores in all the independent magazines and websites. My contention is that these reviews should be questioned. It is why these forums exist. SETH??? has a reviewer on this site ever changed a score because of gamer feedback? Just curious….
Seth
January 23rd, 2009
I’m not aware that score has been changed because of gamer feedback, but the review content certainly could be. A review is a personal opinion at the end of the day, it’s impossible to be perfectly objective.
I think that you put too much weight on the number at the end of the review. I’m not a fan of having to pick a number between one and ten that is supposed to encapsulate a title and experience that may have lasted dozens of hours. The best I can do is give reasonings for my scores and let people decide for themselves whether this is a game that they would like or not.
I feel that I highlighted the minor innovations that Lips has brought to the table (quality mics, gesture control) and mentioned the potential for fun that this game has. But just because something is potentially enjoyable, doesn’t make it good. There is no universal genre checklist, every game is judged on it’s own merits, and if there are competing products available then it’s only fair to compare them.
You say that Lips has ‘dropped 50% points’, which I feel is a strange way to look at it. If you think that there is a default score from which marks are added/deducted, then surely an average 5/10 score would be it?
5/10 does not mean that this is a bad game, it means that the pro’s virtually equal the con’s. It means that it’s a game about which people will have mixed reactions. It means that if you are a fan of that particular genre (as you are), if you love the pro’s (as you do), and if you aren’t bothered by the con’s (as you aren’t) then you’ll enjoy it.
I would prefer if people read the review and used common sense to determine their own personal score, rather than focus on the score. But if this review saves someone from spending £40 on a game which wouldn’t have lived up to expectations then I see that as a job well done. If Lips doesn’t sell enough to warrant a sequel then hopefully MS or iNiS will read some critical reviews to find areas of improvement.
In regards to your point about fun, of course MOST games primary goal is to provide enjoyment for the player, but I had to disagree with your opinion that this is SOLE aim of every game.
Games can do so much more. They can challenge us, scare us, make us laugh and cry, frustrate us, make us feel guilty and so much more. Obviously this range of emotional responses is a bit out of the reach of a karaoke game, but they neglected to include features that their biggest competitor have that can help with the competitive, social and community aspects of such a title. I can’t ignore that.
I’m happy to debate with you all day, but I’m still confident that my review (and the blasted score) are valid.
Grubsworthy
January 23rd, 2009
My guess your one of those people who post without thinking, then think a bit more… and more… up to 4 times in this case. Now lets just say as far as internet debates and dissagreements go this is the most pointless one in a while, you seem to disagree.
Hense the 4 posts.
So…
‘You lose all credibility when you say something like “I don’t agree that the only aim of videogames is to provide us with fun.” Seth i challenge you “NAME THE GAME GENRE WHOSE PRIMARY AND ONLY AIM IS NOT TO PROVIDE FUN”
K, Football management games, the whole purpose of them is to bore people.
Games the military, engineering, racing industries use to train on.
Grubsworthy
January 23rd, 2009
‘What i am suggesting is that the downfalls of the Lips game do not constitute the amount of points it has dropped (50%).
K, this is your opinion, not a fact, Halo 3 had a fair few flaws but id still give the game 2/10 just out of the passion of hatred I have for these fews flaws. The score is not proportionate to how flawed the game is, or how FUN it is, more an indictive opinion based on one soul opinion (ie Deadgood)
‘And Grubsworth, my daughter is 5 years old and so Bach and Mozart are a little boring for her. Im a firm believer in children being children.’
K, I was thinking of thousands of good bands, that kids seem to like such as Coldplay, Arctic Monkeys or Muse, but hey some people just like the shite on the radio.
‘Grubsworth, your message didnt actually add anything to the debate so please desist in future from talking WIND’
K, im sure you could easily have said the soul amount of your arguement GAMES ARE ABOUT FUN with just one well thought out comment, rather than 6.
And i was only mentioning graphics to express my feelings that for the most part video games are starting to go down the pan. It used to be that the majority of games released were actually fun and enjoyable.
K, this year and last year were pretty much amazing for games. Maybe you should play some Wii Shovelware (all about family fun)
Grubsworthy
January 23rd, 2009
‘A stark contrast to the market today where we have a huge amount of graphically accomplished piles of drivel. Im saying that Lips deserves a much better score because of the direction it has taken the genre, and we must always encourage innovation’
K, Don’t agree, innovation has lost all meaning and positives in an arguement since the Wii came out.
‘My contention is that with a score of 5 this discourages the potential buyer,dispite your review contents, and if there are not enough buyers spending their ‘money votes’ there is no Lips2′
K, yup it does, or the poor reviews encorage the developers to make a better product.
‘I think if a reviewer does not take this kind of consideration then he/she is being too frivolous and perhaps a little naive. I am NOT criticising the reviewer for his art of review but just this review and the possible permutations of the score’
K, You blatetly made a game that was critically panned and under played didn’t you are you Peter Molyneux? Are you suggesting reviewers should not exercise objectivity and instead conform to the notion if the developers did their best TEN OUT OF 10
NO
Grubsworthy
January 23rd, 2009
‘Rock on, i love debating games. Hey if everyone was perfect, like me, then the world would be a boring place’
K
‘DEFINITION OF ‘GAME’
any form of play or way of playing; amusement; recreation; sport; frolic; play
any specific contest, engagement, amusement, computer simulation, or sport involving physical or mental competition under specific rules, as football, chess, or war games’
K, are you saying war is fun? you’ve lost me?
Even so a lot of words have moved away from their intended meaning. such as Gangster, no longer meaning a criminal but just a word black kids can throw around to feel cool. Or gay, no longer means happy but now means a rent boy.
With that logic Fun now means what the British did to the people in Tibet in the collonial era. Are you considering genocide fun now? do you know the Tibetians welcomed the British in, and we just opened fire and executed them all. Then we the British didn’t even occupy Tibet because it wasn’t worthwhile in the end.
Do you think thats fun? cause I don’t.
Grubsworthy
January 23rd, 2009
‘Ask yourself this. Why do we play games?
It will be difficult to answer this without using the idea of fun’
K, For stimulus that leads to entertainment.
‘you do realise when you read a manufacturers’ description/synopsis of their product…that this might ….just be …a …little……biased.
K, really? I always trusted everything I ever read. 1/3 of us are immigrants, 1/10 of us want to blow up the people around us and Sciencoligy is a great concept.
‘If Nintendo say the game is FUN but its NOT then it deserves a bad review score. My argument here, which is plain if you can read and show an aptitude for rational thought, is that here we have a game which the masses have construed ‘great fun’, which the reviewer has also stated (SEVERAL TIMES, GRUBSWORTH) is fun… and it still gets a tough review score’
K, if a game is fun, its gets a 10? fair? I’ve seen films so bad their fun, do they get a 10 as well? cause thats what your saying.
‘And ask yourself this also, if these reviewers guidelines and reviewer checklists of what a certain game in a certain genre should have is/are so infalable???? then why are games not given uniformly identical scores in all the independent magazines and websites. My contention is that these reviews should be questioned. It is why these forums exist. SETH??? has a reviewer on this site ever changed a score because of gamer feedback? Just curious’
K, No, this is how it works. Big sites and magazines who go to E3 and stuff like that have to give games good reviews or they’ll get taken off the press list. Thus ruining objectivity.
Dark Zero on the other hand is completely objective, hense they don’t pander to idiots like you.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
grubsworth i have to say not one of your arguments make any sense AT ALL
muse v rhianna (PERSONAL TASTE – U R WRONG)(most 5 yr olds dont like Muse – THEY ARE SHIT) (THIS IS A GAMES FORUM – BE QUIET)
SIMULATIONS are not the same as commercial games, (THE MILITARY DO NOT USE ACE COMBAT TO TRAIN – U MORON)
The Wii has novelty hardware, do not confuse with innovation, innovation can be a soft concept like the direction or design of software. Doesnt always have to be hardware. Innovation is about synergy and synthesis between solid concepts and exciting improvements. So the Wii has not killed the concept of “innovation” GRUBSWORTH DO YOU HAVE AN EDUCATION???
I am not condemning objectivity, far from it, i am merely saying that a list of features should not be used as an exhaustive list to determine how good a game is.
I do not wish to talk about colloquialisms or the misuse of the english language TRY TO FOCUS GRUBSWORTH….
I think you believe half the crap you have typed. I ALSO USUALLY TRY AND RESTRICT THE AMOUNT I TYPE IN FORUMS. hence the multiple msgs. I just couldnt help myself after your moronic comments.
I must contact my old Phd supervisory team and tell them they gave a doctorate to an idiot, all because his daughter likes rhianna and he KNOWS games are about FUN.
This year was good for games but if you look at the market as a whole the good games are perhaps 10% of what is released. So please think about your comments before you write.
SETH, unlike GRUBSWORTH, i think you arguments are sound however the number DOES have a big effect, its psychological. Just like when we go to delete an important file and the OS tells us in big letters “ARE YOU SURE, STUPID” and we click yes. There are some things we cant control.
However the spectrum of emotions is much to complex to discuss to a conclusion here. For example many GREAT games have made me laugh and cry for very different reasons.
WHY DO PEOPLE LIKE GRUBSWORTH EXIST, THEY ARE OXYGEN THEIVES, SOMEONE SHOULD DO SOMETHING ABOUT THEM.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
btw im a software engineer in the financial sector. Not a games developer, i have developed games as a HOBBYIST(as per my initial posts, for educative purposes, demo’ing AI and neural computing concepts etc….
And i have looked at games from an aesthetic design p.o.v.
Grubsworth you seem more interested in just flat out disagreeing than building a valid argument, anyone who says INNOVATION IS A NON ISSUE is a ridiculoyus fool/idiot/moron or is being deliberately obtuse.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
another point, i never said a game should get 10 out 10 if its fun.
if a game is fun and has no other downsides other than a few online features it should not get 5/10.
It should get 9/10
You must also see that you must compare games within the same genre, you are not comparing GOW2 with Lips, this would be unfair because the same development time was not engaged in(probably).
Its my guess that whatever you do Grubworthy, you are not very good at it and have to spout rubbish to people in forums who are only conveying their opinion on a matter. Imagine insulting a child whom you have never met, tut tut tut.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
stimulus that leads to entertainment(FUN???anyone???)
i must remember to say “K,” before saying something because this must add some validity to a nonsensical statement….
well you get away with it so well….
limow
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
OOOO – READ THIS …..
K, this is your opinion, not a fact, Halo 3 had a fair few flaws but id still give the game 2/10 just out of the passion of hatred I have for these fews flaws. The score is not proportionate to how flawed the game is, or how FUN it is, more an indictive opinion based on one soul opinion (ie Deadgood)
You display a lot of characteristics of someone who is incapable of being OBJECTIVE… DO YOU KNOW WHAT A CONTRADICTION IS….. im sorry i didnt spot this it the first time i read your comments, there was so much crap.
but yeah someones opinion who has hatred for this and that cannot instill OBJECTIVITY into a project such as reviewing a game, not saying SETH did, rather that GRUBWORTHY you are a NUMPTY. ssssshhhh now
Grubsworthy
January 23rd, 2009
muse v rhianna (PERSONAL TASTE – U R WRONG)(most 5 yr olds dont like Muse – THEY ARE SHIT) (THIS IS A GAMES FORUM – BE QUIET)
K, Your just an idiot if you think Muse are worse than that no talent, hick, at least Muse write their own songs. Oh and they got an honorary degree from the university of Lincoln, and they didnt have to do anything. Tooooooooooooo bad you had to work for yours.
SIMULATIONS are not the same as commercial games, (THE MILITARY DO NOT USE ACE COMBAT TO TRAIN – U MORON)
K, trust me im in a position to know that, UUUUUU Moron.. (doesnt that bringe more depth to your argument than using caps)
The Wii has novelty hardware, do not confuse with innovation, innovation can be a soft concept like the direction or design of software. Doesnt always have to be hardware. Innovation is about synergy and synthesis between solid concepts and exciting improvements. So the Wii has not killed the concept of “innovation” GRUBSWORTH DO YOU HAVE AN EDUCATION???
K, Innovation in this day and age basically means imbracing old ideas, power glove anyone? Little big planet the best game of last year was 2d! What it isn’t 1994? MY GOD!
And Trust me im well more qualified than you to comment on an INTERNET FORUM (GET OVER YOURSELF).
I am not condemning objectivity, far from it, i am merely saying that a list of features should not be used as an exhaustive list to determine how good a game is.
I do not wish to talk about colloquialisms or the misuse of the english language TRY TO FOCUS GRUBSWORTH….
YOUR NOT THE BOSS OF ME, K
I think you believe half the crap you have typed. I ALSO USUALLY TRY AND RESTRICT THE AMOUNT I TYPE IN FORUMS. hence the multiple msgs. I just couldnt help myself after your moronic comments.
K, I WOULDN’T BE HERE IF IT WASN’T FOR YOUR MORONIC COMMENTS, SOOOOOO
I must contact my old Phd supervisory team and tell them they gave a doctorate to an idiot, all because his daughter likes rhianna and he KNOWS games are about FUN.
YOU LIKE RHIANNA AS WELL, SO YOUR ALSO AN IDIOT, AND YES I THINK THEY SHOULD STRIP YOU OF YOUR PHD AND GIVE IT TO MUSES WHO HAVE MORE TALENT IN THEIR noses THAN YOU HAVE IN TOTAL.
This year was good for games but if you look at the market as a whole the good games are perhaps 10% of what is released. So please think about your comments before you write.
NOPE IT WAS MORE LIKE 30% DONT MAKE UP CRAP, K
WHY DO PEOPLE LIKE GRUBSWORTH EXIST, THEY ARE OXYGEN THEIVES, SOMEONE SHOULD DO SOMETHING ABOUT THEM.
Yea your talking crap now, im actually the son of the Duke of Essex, so im actually more worth existing than you are. I also live in a bigger house than anyone with a PHD could ever hope to.
Grubsworth you seem more interested in just flat out disagreeing than building a valid argument, anyone who says INNOVATION IS A NON ISSUE is a ridiculoyus fool/idiot/moron or is being deliberately obtuse.
The difference between me and you is that I still have things worth saying, wheras your just repeating and justifying your nonsesne.
another point, i never said a game should get 10 out 10 if its fun.
if a game is fun and has no other downsides other than a few online features it should not get 5/10.
It should get 9/10
WOW, WHAT A WASTE OF OXYGEN YOU AND YOUR KIDS ARE
You must also see that you must compare games within the same genre, you are not comparing GOW2 with Lips, this would be unfair because the same development time was not engaged in(probably).
Its my guess that whatever you do Grubworthy, you are not very good at it and have to spout rubbish to people in forums who are only conveying their opinion on a matter. Imagine insulting a child whom you have never met, tut tut tut.
ONE DAY I WILL BE THE DUKE OF ESSEX, SO CAN THE CV BULLSHIT, im above you.
stimulus that leads to entertainment(FUN???anyone???)
Well done on finding all that irony PHD man.
You display a lot of characteristics of someone who is incapable of being OBJECTIVE… DO YOU KNOW WHAT A CONTRADICTION IS….. im sorry i didnt spot this it the first time i read your comments, there was so much crap.
Half of my post were quoting you in full, so the crap is pretty much all yours. K
Seth
January 23rd, 2009
I think that your development background may have given you a slightly unalterable stance on review scores. Innovation is something to be valued, but the score doesn’t represent how innovative a game is, it tries to represent how good that particular game is in comparison to its peers (if possible.)
I don’t believe that I ever compared Lips to Gears 2. I was actually mostly comparing to the original Singstar which is nearly five years old. Had I played Singstar PS3 I would have compared it to that too.
I don’t agree that if a game only has a few flaws then it should automatically be entitled to a high score. A reviewer should not start with a default 10/10 score and be knocking points off for flaws. It doesnt work that way.
I believe a title needs to earn a high score. Maybe my reviewing motto should be ‘Average until proven otherwise’. I note that many other publications seem to use 7/10 as an average score, which kind of defeats the whole point of having a scoring system at all…
You said that Lips deserves 9/10. No other reviewers agree with that score. Do I care? No, because it’s your opinion. I’m glad that you enjoy the game.
Imagine if the text of my review was identical, but the number at the end was a 7. Would it really make you feel better?
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
The Duke Of Essex Is A Stupid Numpty Title.
Everyone knows people like you are full of shite and will never amount to anything. Just coz you belong to a certain family doesnt mean you are above anyone, in fact you will never have the intellect or status i have. People will regard you with the pathetic disdain which you deserve and laugh at you in private, i on the other hand am proven to be excellent and worthwhile.
I am no longer going to engage in this ridiculous conversation with you. I might however write a letter to the duke of essex and let him know his son is a god damn moron.
Laters all.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
Seth i agree totally, most of what i said last time was aimed at that moron duke of damn ballonville.
This started out as a simple sharing of opinions.
What i will say is that you have a very defensive viewpoint and the very fact that you have NEVER changed a score despite user feedback shows me that you are not open to others ideas and if you are you feel yours are always superior. You should think about re-reviewing this game i think but if you dont. Well it wont matter because i still know its good.
Have you ever heard of mystery shoppers? These exist in the game reviews world also….something to think about.
laters
Grubsworthy
January 23rd, 2009
Yea Chris, Im actually a really smart ex video game reviewer, Im also a professional internet troll.
So you were tonights meat, thanks for being a good sport.
For whats its worth, i don’t really agree with you. I just find being obtuse and irritating makes this debates so much more intresting.
I also enjoy how you stooped to my level, for a while there we had something very special.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
Grubsworthy, Seth does not agree with you. He says innovation should be valued.
Ergo, u r a moron and we are not.
Go and ask your butler for a helping of brains or keep it shizzle.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
And im really Prince William, the queen is going to have kittens when she hears about this.
I do hope you were actually fooling around about what you wrote.
Especially the muse thing, they really are the most awful drone….
I get a kick out of this too. But it might have been more interesting had you actually participated properly.
Lips rules. 9/10
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
i dont really have a phd either.
I do have a bachelors and masters but it looks like im not the only one who is gay about their online mystique..
Seth
January 23rd, 2009
Ermm.. I’ve never had reason to change a review due to user feedback. Why would someone else telling me their opinion change mine? I don’t understand what you’re saying here.
I am certainly open to other people’s ideas, but you’ve not told me anything that shows this game to be anymore than average.
How would a Mystery Shopper work in ‘the game reviews world’? It’s a personal opinion, not a product or service. You’ve lost me completely now.
Steve
January 23rd, 2009
Wow, I missed one hell of an arguement.
I do know Grubsworth tho, hes very good at finding a weakness in novice posters and pushing them over the edge.
Chris your comments were definatly not worth saying tho, Seth’s been able to throw every one of your points away. It all comes down to squabling over objectability, Seth is the finest reviewer on DarkZero and his reviews are always fare, I am suprised he humoured you so long.
I do know Grubs, nobelilty he is not, but hilarious he definatly is.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
he threw them all back in my face but unsuccessfully. He never actually built an argument against any of my points but skirted them. I dont care if you are buddies. But i think a post should add something to the arguement. Im not saying and never did day Seth was not objective, but i dont agree that fun is not the main aim of a video game, i think this should be the most heavily weighted item in the discussion. And all those other items such as online features should only accrue to perhaps 1 out of 10. Im not the only peron who feels this way, there is a massive amount of people who hate the online gaming community for influencing studios to produce online-only games, games centred around online play with little or no consideration for 1p campaign and so on and so forth. If you read my posts i try to make valid, logical points.
Seth, sometimes your opinion, in retrospect, can be too harsh or too easy. I am sorry if i lost you. But sometimes what we think is right on one day, we can change our minds on.
The game has the main components singstar has, and has added seom BRAND NEW features at the expense of some already existing, perhaps tiresome ones. its a trade off. What im saying is this is not an average Kareoke game, because of how few there are and how fun this is, its way above average.
Im sorry if u dont want to retract your score.
Steve im not here to be humoured. The people posting on this site have a really curious way about them.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
What about the “games are not for fun” argument, i didnt win that one???
im surprised…
Grubsworthy
January 23rd, 2009
Looks at how long this page is…
Get a LIFE, k
I set out to waste your time, you ended up wasting mine because your points are flaccid.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
lol….
im on call this evening until 7pm so im being paid a ridiculous amount of money to sit here and argue with the people on this site.
And no my arguements are perfectly valid.
I personally believe you should be an ex-video game developer before you can be a reviewer, it makes sense, who ever heard of a food critic who doesnt know how to cook???
If you dont know what goes into a game, what the essence of a game is you are just an END USER.
lol.
Seth
January 23rd, 2009
Please let me know which of your points I didn’t reply to. I thought I’d covered them all.
I feel that most of the new features add nothing much to the genre. My review covered all this… The minigames are fun for five minutes, the gesture-based percussion is a nice addition ( but nothing revolutionary), the song importing is pointless.
I’ve already listed the features that it lacks, only one of which was online-related. This game is lacking in singleplayer gameplay too, in my opinion.
Chris, you have clearly gone seeking out less-than-glowing reviews for a game that you love (for some reason). Why do you find it so hard to accept that our opinions differ?
I could understand if I had not justified the 5/10 score, but I felt that I have done this well enough.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
at the end of the day, turn ur 360 and have some FUN…. instead of analysing all the “oo it has a scoreboard” some of the finest games i have ever played didnt have a scoreboard, and i still fail to see any other aim of a game other than FUN. Not one.
everything else is either a route to FUN or a biproduct…
Peace Out.
Seth
January 23rd, 2009
When did I ever say that games aren’t for fun? You said that they were ONLY for fun. I’m pretty sure you were proven wrong at that.
Saying that you have to develop games before you can criticise them is absurb. This isnt a requirement in any other critical medium, so why gaming?
Seth
January 23rd, 2009
I have a lot of fun thanks. There is just a huge list of games that I’d rather play than Lips. So I do..
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
I do accept your score, its just when i first said i thot it was unfair, all you had to say was “i dont agree” but when u argue and become defensive u must expect a rebuttle.
All im saying is i think this is a bit harsh and you keep coming back with a response which i dont agree with….
the “fun is not the aim of a game” is baffling and i HAVE TO KEEP MENTIONING IT. lol
i cant help it…
But if i was the reviewer and more than one person on a forum said they thot my review was way too harsh (i think im person #3 here) then i would consider a retraction or at least a re-review.
All i ever wanted was some recognition that PERHAPS you were HARSH. But im really only here to have a debate.
There is no need to become defensive. And you covered all my points in respect that you replied to them but most were skirted around, the thing is on one hand ur saying its just our opinions but then on the other there is an air about you that says “but actually i think im right and ur wrong!”
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
I dont think its absurb i think to be able to critique you have to know.
You can criticise anything, Im criticising you heavily and you dont agree. To be a critic you should know. and not just tick off a checklist.
How was i proven wrong on the fun is not the only aim
name a game that is not fun and is still successfull
i challenge you,
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
Anyone? feel free to help Seth out.
Since you 3 think im so wrong.
Name the game which is >= 8/10 but which is not FUN.
Since i have been proved wrong tell me the other AIM of video game design.
Steve
January 23rd, 2009
Boy oh boy,
Seriously you don’t think Dead is fit to review because he hasn’t any insider experience within the video game industry.
Then he wouldn’t have the view point that this site wants, for gamers, by gamers.
Otherwise its pretty much reading the back of the box or an official magazine. And as you said before, thats a very pointless thing to do if you want a fair review.
Seth
January 23rd, 2009
You seem to be ignoring the word ONLY. I agree, as I said before (sigh) that fun is the main aim of most games. I don’t agree that it is the ONLY aim of ALL games. Understand now?
People like to disagree with bad reviews of games that they have purchased, because they like to justify their purchase. It’s quite simple. People have also become used to other sites using 7/10 as an average score, so 5/10 seems terribly low to them.
I’ve said several times that this is my own personal opinion. There is no right or wrong answer. But when writing a review I must try and put forward all the facts and attempt to be slightly objective. I would feel bad if I glossed over, or didnt mention a game’s flaws.
You havent given one concrete reason why this game deserves a higher score, apart from ‘IT’S FUN’. So is singing in the shower…
You yourself said that games have made you cry. Is sadness a byproduct of fun?
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
I suggest you guys talk more with games design companies and ask them the main design aim of any video game. Im betting it comes up the same everytime.
Chill people and keep thinking of the elusive game thats not FUN, the excalibur of video games. MUHAHAHAH
lawl
Seth
January 23rd, 2009
Sorry, Chris. You’ve let yourself down. You’re quite clearly a troll.
Steve
January 23rd, 2009
Your just a troll
But thank you for all the hits you’ve given us today.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
what are the other aims of games???
dont mention emotions, because evoking emotions is FUN….people pay hundreds of pounds on trips to theme parks to have the wits scared out of them on rollercoasters because ITS FUN. we ENJOY it.
And Steve, once you are an ex-video game developer and become a reviewer you do not lose the ability of impartiality. Did IQ’s suddenly drop this winter.
Someone who has worked at a few different companies can appreciate different ethos and approach to game design it can actually help in critique.
I dont understand how an ex-expert would automatically write a biased manufacturers description im sorry i dont agree with you even a little.
The gamers by gamers argument is weak and i would say that Seth is more than a gamer because he has to be, people look to him for advice.
I am a gamer, i hate RPGS so my reviews of all FF games would be 0 or 1/10. A reviewer MUST be more than a gamer otherwise he/she is useless. not u Seth.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
no-one pays any attention to web site hits.
dont be a tech-noob.
i can write a piece of code in 30 secs that will give this site 10 hits a second.
No one trusts it anymore.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
i have been called many things in my life, and im only 24, but a troll is not one of them.
i just dont suffer fools gladly. lol
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
btw if you ever need ur hits improved i can write a watir script to hit the site and post messages for you as well, for a small price of course.
Seth
January 23rd, 2009
You are hilarious, Chris. Thanks.
According to your definition, there is no other emotion but FUN. Brilliant..
I do agree that a reviewer must be more than the average gamer. They must know how to evaluate games critically as well as just focusing on the FUN they feel while playing. I don’t agree that a reviewer must have developed games in the past to be able to criticise them. Although having an understanding of the development process could be of slight assistance.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
OMG who said fun = every emotion…
i said the invocation of an emotion is fun….
being scared is fun
being amused is fun
being challenged is fun
so a game is always aimed at a FUN expierence.
Do you not understand plain english.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
i cant believe the last post Seth, its very poor.
Im going to bow out, as champion i dont think there is any chance of a challenge to my point, just pointless put downs and name calling.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
lol no thats not what being a good reviewer is about. i know i have written many technical documents evaluating software. Usability, accessibility, (for example in one of my posts i mentioned one of the most difficult issues surround usability design know to man…) you are merely playing with words to try and bully me into conceding and very valid point. FUN is the only aim of a video game, if its not fun people will not play. Please condede this point resistance is futile. lol
Seth
January 23rd, 2009
Yes, but the way that you define FUN, means that everything else is just an ‘invocation’ of that. That being that case, you’re using circular logic to fulfil your own argument.
Games only aim is FUN, because everything is an aspect of FUN..
Well done.
Steve
January 23rd, 2009
What I did there was white wash my opinion to simplify it so you might understand.
Not many ex-video game industry people are game reviews but I don’t understand why their opinions are any less objectable that anyone elses. If anything they’ll be more sypethetic which is a bad thing. At worst they’d fill up with useless information about the complexities of game design and the coding.
Reviews are given by reviewers, people who know all the fundermental elements taken to objectifally look at a game. They do not need insider experience.
And you are a fool, you didnt pick up on the trolling about 3 hours ago and you still dont make a sensible arguement.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
lol learn how to spell first
i dont piss about on the internet like some people and i was having a debate.
As far as i am concerned i dont care if the other people are taking the piss or not, if they then they are scum.
If this was a serious site you would look down upon that. I cant make any sense of ur comments on ex-developers. please re-read.
which college did u learn how to be a reviewer???
numpty
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
u people really are idiots, im done trying to spoon feed you some LOGIC.
Steve
January 23rd, 2009
If your going to bow out, do so.
What your doing is posting 2 seconds later like a child who can’t control themselves.
And your boring us both immensly.
Seth
January 23rd, 2009
Ok, Chris. I agree that IF all other emotions are aspects of fun, then all games are aimed at providing fun.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
lol i still didnt get an answer to my question! why? because i am right and you are wrong and that is why u have resorted to name calling and such..its the sign of a low IQ…. however i have enjoyed stooping down here with you.
Im away to play Lips because despite this Joke of a review it is much more entertaining than this forum.
I will also be telling everyone in my quite large computing and gaming circle how nasty the people on this site are.
Well done, ur word of mouth marketing is awesome.
Steve
January 23rd, 2009
Are you happy you’ve reduced the complex scale of human emotion and objectiveness down to a simple childish phrase?
GAMES ARE ABOUT FUN
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
o dear god, i dont quite believe it.
Well done thats partial credit.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
no no im not the teacher in donnie darko
seth said that the aims of games are sometimes to scare, excite etc and i agree but this is because these features, these invocations of emotions are there because its fun
Steve
January 23rd, 2009
You’ve been gradually simplifying your arguement, dropping the bits you realise don’t make sense and thinking we don’t notice.
Not 2 hours ago this arguement wasn’t half as fragmented or confusing. And that was before Grubs got bored.
Seth
January 23rd, 2009
What question did you need an answer for, Chris?
I apologise if you feel I have been nasty to you. Although… they do say that all publicity is good publicity…
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
you should never forget that games are for FUN.
i have helped you today people.
you might not know it yet, but some day some day
Steve
January 23rd, 2009
Your not actually going to go play Lips, because I don’t think you even like it as much as you’ve expressed here.
The only way to get rid of you is to SAY you’d rather be here argueing on an internet forum than actually having fun playing a shitty game like Lips.
Meanwhile Im going to go and listen to Muse, possibly the best band of the 2000’s.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
Steve my argument has been the same the whole time… i put forth points, i feel u dont understand the most simple building blocks of language or debate. Seth no need to apologise you have been largely very good to debate with, the other 2 however not so good and for other users reading this, seeing that honest posts are answered by KNOWN as you call them TROLLS and this is encouraged is a bit of a joke. U wud need to sort this.
Again Steve focus on the debate and stop attacking me.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
Muse are awful i bought that damn symmetry album years ago on friends recommendo and i cried for 2 solid days that my 9.99 was gone.
Bloody awful pap…
Seth
January 23rd, 2009
Thanks Chris for helping to realise that every emotion that I feel is actually FUN. Like Steve said, you’ve really oversimplified everything. I do kind of understand what you’re trying to say though, that people like to challenge, scare themselves because ultimately it’s a safe environment and there is a vicarious thrill because of that. But I still think that you’re simplifying things too much and that your definition of FUN is wayyy too broad.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
I would say that Lips is a superb game, it fits the bill to which it has been advertised.
There is nothing worse than something being marketed as something it is not. like the PS3 and its non-unified Ram(for another forum perhaps- altho not here)
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
i did not ever define FUN as every emotion
people feel a wide spectrum of emotions, and the severity of these are not always in the gamut of FUN
someone being chased by crazed people with knives is feeled scared but its not fun for them.
when people design games they pick a genre they pick some emotions they want to invoke, why do they do this, because they know that if successful they WILL invoke these emotions and the user will ENJOY this, they will have FUN with the game.
OH DEAR GOD OF JESUS MARY AND JOSEPH.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
I WOULD LOVE TO SIT DOWN WITH YOU PEOPLE AND TALK FACE TO FACE BECAUSE SOMETHING HAS BEEN LOST IN TRANSLATION HERE, ITS A REALLY SIMPLE CONCEPT IM FLOATING HERE AND ITS NOT CATCHING.
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
Seth you are the most pedantic person i have ever chatted with.
Every word i have written has been treated with contempt and misinterpreted deliberately, is this what u call TROLLING.
Steve
January 23rd, 2009
Theres is nothing more to this arguement than FUCK YOU, k
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
ON A SIDE NOTE I WILL LEAVE YOU WITH SOME GOOD ADVICE
look out for spotify
its the future of music, i got an invite there for the free version and its amazing.
check it out… even tho u people are so nasty……..im nice
Chris Weeks
January 23rd, 2009
lovely STEVE
very good language skills, i do hope ur not a reviewer here.
Seth
January 23rd, 2009
Steve, that was uncalled for.
Chris, I apologise again for misunderstanding your point. This back-and-forth posting is possibly not the best method for discussion. Tone does not come across well on the internet, and I believe that there has been a misunderstanding here.
Of course, ultimately people play games for enjoyment. If that is what you were trying to say then I agree with you. It just seems that your definition of the word fun differs from mine.
I still feel that the issue is more complex than this though.
In regards to Spotify, I have it and it’s great. If you check out our forum here you’ll see that lots of us love it too.
Steve
January 24th, 2009
Sorry, don’t know what came over me Seth.
Foul mouthednessness I guess.
SinglikeaBitch
July 23rd, 2009
This game is sooo hard for men to play. Most of the songs are girly songs or sung by men with high voices. Seriously, you need to put a rubber band around your testicles to actually score in this game….and there are none supplied, so how am I spose to get the infinity rank ? ? ?
Alan
July 23rd, 2009
Try crying out each word, makes it easier to hit the top notes.
Sean
July 24th, 2009
I’m pretty sure the game doesn’t mind if you sing in a different octave, as long as the notes are the same.
Alan
August 21st, 2009
I miss Chris Weeks